Stihl MS 180 hard to pull start

[amphoterik]

Howdy everyone, looking for some help with my first chainsaw, a Stihl MS180 that won't start.

I bought this brand new last year. I only used it once (with fresh fuel and oil) to cut down a tree in the back yard. When I was done, I ran it dry and stored it for the winter. Fast forward to this year, I topped up the oil and added fresh fuel, but the thing won't start. It won't even begin to turn over. Here are some things to narrow it down:
-New 50:1 fuel mix
-Spark plug does spark when I pull the starter rope
-Fuel is making to the spark plug
-The starter is very easy to pull when the spark plug is out, but very hard to pull when the spark plug is installed (it almost feels jammed)
-I found oil / gas in the canister to the front of the saw. I believe it is the muffler but I am not sure?
-The chain lock is engaged and I am in closed choke position

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I can't imagine anything being super wrong with it given how new it is. Thanks!

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

Sounds like the saw is flooded and the crankcase is full of fuel.
What I would do is pull the spark plug, turn the saw upside down so any fuel can run out of the spark plug hole and while inverted- pull the starter rope to rotate the engine.
Excess fuel inside the machine should spill out of the plug hole, keep moving/shaking the saw, pulling the starter until the fuel is all out.
Dry off the spark plug best you can, blow off with compressed air is good- reassemble the saw and start as per the operators manual, or the "starting your Stihl saw" on the Stihl website. They have excellent basic troubleshooting tips for new users.

 

[amphoterik]

Thanks for the advice. I was able to drain excess fluid out of the body by turning it over with the spark plug out. Once everything was dried, I noticed that the pull was hard even if I just covered the spark plug hole with my finger. So I assume it is related to the compression stroke.

I put everything back together and added new fresh fuel, and it still won't start (still hard to pull until I get pulling in a rhythm). Any other ideas? I hate to take it for maintenance since I've only ever used it once!

 

[amphoterik]

I should also note that the exhaust port and pistons look clear of any carbon or debris that could be impeding performance

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

I should also note that the exhaust port and pistons look clear of any carbon or debris that could be impeding performance

So you have had the muffler off the saw and looked at the face of the piston through the exhaust port?
And the piston still looks like brand new with visible tooling marks?

My next guess would be something astray in either side of the crank externally- either a recoil starter mishap inside the cover- busted pulley or misaligned pawls. Or on the power take off side- chain bound between oil pump and clutch bell drive spur kind of thing.
Photos will be a lot easier than trying to explain things and us playing guessing games.

 

[amphoterik]

Yes, the pistons looks brand new.

I will take some photos today to help narrow things down. I'm not sure what the parts you mentioned are, specifically, so I will just take the casing off and take a bunch of pics.

Thanks again for the help!

 

[amphoterik]

Ok, took some pics of the various parts. Let me know if this is helpful or if there are other things to take pics of

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

How about if you disengage the chain brake- is it easier to pull the starter rope then?

 

[amphoterik]

I would have to reassemble to test for certain, but I do not believe so. I believe it was just as hard or harder. I didn't want to force it since I didn't know if it was supposed to be pullable with the brake disengaged.

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

That is one of the grey areas of "proper starting procedure", but I for one never start any saw with the brake engaged.
Granted- I have a few years (decades) of experience, but it is one of those grown ups decisions you make now and then in life- your preferred method of starting a saw.
Many people drop start chainsaws- you will not find instructions in manuals on how to go about that either.

 

[amphoterik]

I tried drop starting as it was the easier way to actually pull the start cord, however it still didn't even begin to turn over

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

Looks to still be a lot of residual oils and possibly fuel draining from the exhaust port in one of the photos- I wonder if it is flooded well enough to be hydro locked with fluids.
You could try removing the spark plug, washing out the cylinder and case with fresh fuel mix and sit the saw up so it is upside down with the plug hole lowermost so it can drain overnight.
Thats about it it can be- but you can also put the starter back together and try pulling it over without the bar and chain fitted to see if that is any easier.

 

[amphoterik]

Ok, I flushed it with clean fuel and drained it. Will wait until tomorrow to check it. The only thing I haven't look at yet is the carburetor. Is there anything I should look at there?

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

Ok, I flushed it with clean fuel and drained it. Will wait until tomorrow to check it. The only thing I haven't look at yet is the carburetor. Is there anything I should look at there?

Probably not with a low hour use saw.
Did you drop the piston down to the bottom of the stroke to wash it out? My guess is there is something fluid like sitting in the crankcase under the piston causing your issues.

 

[amphoterik]

I'm not certain what that means, but I pulled the cord slowly to ensure the piston went to both its highest and lowest points. I've left it at its lowest point to dry.

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

Just for giggles and while it is half pulled apart- put the starter back on and see if it pulls over easier WITHOUT the muffler on.
Perfectly safe to do so and you can even start/run the saw without a muffler- its just a bit louder.

 

[amphoterik]

With the spark plug back in it is still difficult to pull. It is difficult to pull even if I just put my finger over the spark plug hole. If it would help I can put some gas in it and see if it will start regardless. I could also try recording a video so you can see / hear it

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

With the spark plug back in it is still difficult to pull. It is difficult to pull even if I just put my finger over the spark plug hole. If it would help I can put some gas in it and see if it will start regardless. I could also try recording a video so you can see / hear it

Yes, but is that with the muffler still on the saw?

 

[amphoterik]

Is this the muffler? If so, then yes it is off. If not, then I am wrong about what the muffler is!

 

[amphoterik]

Ok, took some pics of the various parts. Let me know if this is helpful or if there are other things to take pics of View attachment 1542

I believe this is the front exhaust with the muffler off (this is the previous pic, I have since cleaned and dried it)